SPOILERS: Entwined with You Overall Discussion

[GiGi]

I totally agree with this.  I feel the private wedding will remain private.  At least for now.

 

These pix of Henry are something else.  I have seen him as CG on their fan page and here as Gideon.  Then I read somewhere that love scenes make him uncomfortable.  He is just the hottest man I have seen in forever.  This is funny because I told my friends that my husband and I are going to see SUPERMAN this weekend.  They all know how I feel about violence on TV and the screen so the response I got------OK, so why are you seeing this movie?  I was honest.  A lot of eye rolling.  Hey, I may be almost 64 but I ain't dead yet.

Lady, you have a great sense of humour!  

[GiGi]

The site wouldn't allow me to post my smiley handcuffs.  Not appropriate?  I wonder if the administrators read the book at all? 

Hillarious!  

[GiGi]

in response to Eva having a wedding band with the diamond engagement, I don't think so.  On page 310   reaching into my purse, I unzipped the small pocket and drew out the rings inside it, slipping mine on.  The other ring I believe is the one she bought for Gideon.  page 312. I have something for you and that is when she placed the wedding band on his hand.....then hot sex!!!

 

I don't think any pictures were taken at the private ceremony.  no mention of a photographer, but I could be wrong.  I believe he is referring to the future wedding.  I like the response Eva gave her Mom about having the wedding in June...ask Gideon if he will wait until June.....

Hi Jmhope, 

Good point. 

[GiGi]

I think pedophiles are obviously sick and twisted people in their thoughts and attractions to young children and if they act upon it they are evil and digusting. But anyone who knows of the abuse of a child and stands back and does nothing. While allowing the abuse to continue is 10 times worse in my book. What excuse does a normal person have for not helping a defenseless innocent child.

Hi Jennpenn926, 

I agree with you completely.  There is no excuse for ever harming a child!  What boggles my mind is the person who thinks that they can single-handedly handle a situation like this themselves.  I can understand a person wanting to rescue a child and wanting to do something good, but those good intentions can end up causing far more harm!

 

Yes!  Physically intervening and stopping an abuse in progress is Great!!  That isn't the only step though.  A person has to take the next step and contact the police or CPS.  So many people think that if they turn a blind eye that the situation will go away and that the child will eventually forget about the incident(s), but what some people don't realize is that children don't know how to process what has happened to them and often end up acting out, etc. because they can't deal with all of the experiences and emotions. 

[GiGi]

I want to respond to so many posts. Instead I'll just give my thoughts:

I'm mad at Gideon for dropping everything to go to the hospital. He had no business there. It's not his baby and her husband is in town trying to get her back wtf?

There's more to Megumi's story. Sylvia mentions her not responding to Eva's concerns often. Is she planted there by someone to spy on Eva? Or dating someone from Eva's past?

I'm dying to know how Gideon got possession of his mom's engagement ring.

Don't like Tatiana at all. Cary probably is attracted to her because he has a crush in Eva (both blondes) and she's a witch like his mom. That's what he knows. She'll never go away now that she's knocked-up.

The office space could be for Eva. Gideon always gets his way. And they have already Christened the sofa!

Deanna Deanna Deanna needs to not touch Gideon.

And Christopher Jr. Is a troublemaker. I think he's in between his mom and Corrine stirring it up. He is probably the one behind the music video concept at Times Square and the one feeding Lizzy with the relationship info about Eva and Brett's past.

I love London. I don't think they can corrupt her. She's so happy getting to know Gideon and sees how cool Eva is. And she recognizes true love.

Is Victor good for another 20 years? He's single, so I'm more disappointed in momma Monica. Whew! I hope she didn't get pregnant on Eva's bed! Funny how Cary asked Victor if he ever thought of having more kids. OMG. Can you imagine?

K. That's all I've got.

  

Hi MicheleWV,

I agree with you.

• Gideon had absolutely no business going to the hospital.
• Your theories about Megumi are intriguing.  I never thought that she could possibly be a plant.  My question would be: who would be behind planting Megumi in that office?  What would they hope to gain by spying on Eva?
• Your comments about Deanna not touching Gideon are HILLARIOUS!!!     
• I wonder how Gideon got his mom’s engagement ring.  Thus far my thought is that he inherited the ring upon turning legal age but I could be wrong.
• Your link between Cary’s tolerating Tatiana’s bad behaviour and his past experiences with his mom is great!  I never stopped to think about that in that way.  Great points!
• I agree I like Ireland too! 
• The thought about Victor having more kids is just too delicious for words!!  Your comments about Victor are HILLARIOUS too!!!       

 Great thoughts Michele!  Thanks for sharing them! 

[jennpenn926]

Hi Jennpenn926,

I agree with you completely. There is no excuse for ever harming a child! What boggles my mind is the person who thinks that they can single-handedly handle a situation like this themselves. I can understand a person wanting to rescue a child and wanting to do something good, but those good intentions can end up causing far more harm!

Yes! Physically intervening and stopping an abuse in progress is Great!! That isn't the only step though. A person has to take the next step and contact the police or CPS. So many people think that if they turn a blind eye that the situation will go away and that the child will eventually forget about the incident(s), but what some people don't realize is that children don't know how to process what has happened to them and often end up acting out, etc. because they can't deal with all of the experiences and emotions.

What's completely saddening and sickening is alot of victims in turn become pedophiles themselves. Because they are never helped and never recieve the proper therapy to help them cope with all they feel some become so brainwashed that they believe pedophila is normal. I completely agree just stoping the abuse of one child isn't enough people definitely need to invovle the police to stop the person in the future.

[EmVeeCrossfire]

Love reading everyone's posts they crack me up and get me through my day can't get enough!!

Okay so please no one shank me for my next statement so hear me out!... I honestly think yes Christopher jr is a real ...however... I think I do have a soft spot for him in a way... There's so much more to this then what we are picturing and seeing for ourselves the fact that he's younger then gideon and was obviously aware of what Hugh was doing to young gideon had to frighten an already rebelling little boy seeking attention of his mother but here's my question do we think Chrissy jr was molested as well? And perhaps denied these allegations bc he was afraid?

In riy I keep remembering the day eva was about to chew Chrissy jr a new one but then relented when she herself realized he was just a child himself and that all his issues were pure jealousy ... Maybe once the truth is brought to light and hopefully eva slaps some reality into Elizabeth we can dig into the root of Chrissy jr and find that maybe he really loves his older brother and idolizes him so much that the truth will break down his walls?? ... Just a thought lol

[GiGi]

What's completely saddening and sickening is alot of victims in turn become pedophiles themselves. Because they are never helped and never recieve the proper therapy to help them cope with all they feel some become so brainwashed that they believe pedophila is normal. I completely agree just stoping the abuse of one child isn't enough people definitely need to invovle the police to stop the person in the future.

Hi Jennpenn926, 

I don't know what the statistics are on abuse victims becoming pedophiles themselves.  I wouldn't even want to hazard a guess.  Given the circumsances that happened with my school; I don't think that any of the kids who were abused ever thought  that what happened was normal.  Many of those who were abused, suffered greatly.  Many had horrendous addictions to drugs and/or alcohol and weren't able to complete their schooling or maintain employment.  To the best of knowledge, not one victim in my graduating class went on to abuse anyone else.  Thank you God for that.   

 

The interesting part of this whole situation is the fact that none of the parents or staff thought it fit to call the police or Children's Aid/CPS.  Everyone involved literally turned a blind eye to what was going on.  Many people were reluctant to come forward and speak about what happened to them because they were afraid of the stigma attached to  being an abuse survivor.  Some people felt that it was best to leave well-enough alone or that it wasn't any of their business.  So it was this silence that allowed one sick individual to wreak havoc on countless lives. 

[GiGi]

Love reading everyone's posts they crack me up and get me through my day can't get enough!!

Okay so please no one shank me for my next statement so hear me out!... I honestly think yes Christopher jr is a real ###### ...however... I think I do have a soft spot for him in a way... There's so much more to this then what we are picturing and seeing for ourselves the fact that he's younger then gideon and was obviously aware of what Hugh was doing to young gideon had to frighten an already rebelling little boy seeking attention of his mother but here's my question do we think Chrissy jr was molested as well? And perhaps denied these allegations bc he was afraid?

In riy I keep remembering the day eva was about to chew Chrissy jr a new one but then relented when she herself realized he was just a child himself and that all his issues were pure jealousy ... Maybe once the truth is brought to light and hopefully eva slaps some reality into Elizabeth we can dig into the root of Chrissy jr and find that maybe he really loves his older brother and idolizes him so much that the truth will break down his walls?? ... Just a thought lol

Hi EmVeeCrossfire,

You make a good point.  It is plausible that Christopher Jr. may also have been abused by Hugh.  It wouldn't surprise me in the least.  I could also see a scenario of Jr. walking in on Gideon being abused and him being so traumatized that he rebelled. I wonder if Elizabeth Vidal had Christopher Jr. examined as well.   I hope that these questions are answered with the next two books. 

 

I don't know if Christopher Jr. lied or not, or whether Elizabeth Vidal lied or not.  That entire situation is just one huge honking question!!

 

I was thinking about what some people in the forum have been saying about Dr. Lucas having not seen any physical signs of abuse on Gideon (when he examined him), but why would Dr. Lucas need to lie or "cover-up" any allegations of abuse if there were none?  That doesn't make sense.   How can you cover up something that doesn't exist?   Dr. Lucas wouldn't have had to worry about his brother-in-law because he would have known that the allegations were false.  He wouldn't have had to hide anything from his wife because there was nothing to hide.  The would have been no signs of physical abuse afterall.

 

If Dr. Lucas neglected to inform the Medical Board about the alleged abuse, then yes he would face fines and penalties and a suspension of his medical license.  If it went that far and the Medical Board got invovled, they would subpoena Dr. Lucas's medical files and Gideon's files as well. The chart would have clearly documented that no signs of abuse could be found.  Dr. Lucas  would have had a nurse there during the examination and she would have been able to testify to the fact that there weren't any signs of abuse.

 

I guess that what I am getting at is; if Dr. Lucas truely didn't find any signs of abuse then what is there to cover up?  Dr. Lucas could document his findings in Gideon's chart  with confidence without worry of reprisal.  There would be nothing to cover up.  What do you think?

[Bookworm]

I want to respond to so many posts. Instead I'll just give my thoughts:

I'm mad at Gideon for dropping everything to go to the hospital. He had no business there. It's not his baby and her husband is in town trying to get her back wtf?

There's more to Megumi's story. Sylvia mentions her not responding to Eva's concerns often. Is she planted there by someone to spy on Eva? Or dating someone from Eva's past?

I'm dying to know how Gideon got possession of his mom's engagement ring.

Don't like Tatiana at all. Cary probably is attracted to her because he has a crush in Eva (both blondes) and she's a witch like his mom. That's what he knows. She'll never go away now that she's knocked-up.

The office space could be for Eva. Gideon always gets his way. And they have already Christened the sofa!

Deanna Deanna Deanna needs to not touch Gideon.

And Christopher Jr. Is a troublemaker. I think he's in between his mom and Corrine stirring it up. He is probably the one behind the music video concept at Times Square and the one feeding Lizzy with the relationship info about Eva and Brett's past.

I love London. I don't think they can corrupt her. She's so happy getting to know Gideon and sees how cool Eva is. And she recognizes true love.

Is Victor good for another 20 years? He's single, so I'm more disappointed in momma Monica. Whew! I hope she didn't get pregnant on Eva's bed! Funny how Cary asked Victor if he ever thought of having more kids. OMG. Can you imagine?

K. That's all I've got.

OMG Michelle, anything is possible. Monica pregnant theory.

But Cary crushing on Eva, I don't think so. They have brotherly sisterly love.

[Sheens263]

I totally agree with this.  I feel the private wedding will remain private.  At least for now.

 

These pix of Henry are something else.  I have seen him as CG on their fan page and here as Gideon.  Then I read somewhere that love scenes make him uncomfortable.  He is just the hottest man I have seen in forever.  This is funny because I told my friends that my husband and I are going to see SUPERMAN this weekend.  They all know how I feel about violence on TV and the screen so the response I got------OK, so why are you seeing this movie?  I was honest.  A lot of eye rolling.  Hey, I may be almost 64 but I ain't dead yet.

I read that too, however, I posted a link on the thread "who we see as Gideon, Mark Eva etc " where in the article Henry has said if the script for FSOG was good he would consider doing that so if we could get him to do Gideon before FSOG comes out then that would be better.

[Sheens263]

Love reading everyone's posts they crack me up and get me through my day can't get enough!!

Okay so please no one shank me for my next statement so hear me out!... I honestly think yes Christopher jr is a real ###### ...however... I think I do have a soft spot for him in a way... There's so much more to this then what we are picturing and seeing for ourselves the fact that he's younger then gideon and was obviously aware of what Hugh was doing to young gideon had to frighten an already rebelling little boy seeking attention of his mother but here's my question do we think Chrissy jr was molested as well? And perhaps denied these allegations bc he was afraid?

In riy I keep remembering the day eva was about to chew Chrissy jr a new one but then relented when she herself realized he was just a child himself and that all his issues were pure jealousy ... Maybe once the truth is brought to light and hopefully eva slaps some reality into Elizabeth we can dig into the root of Chrissy jr and find that maybe he really loves his older brother and idolizes him so much that the truth will break down his walls?? ... Just a thought lol

it is a good thought of yours, I must admit the bit in RIY where Lizzard said that Christopher was there and said nothing happened has always confused me as I always wondered if he was in the same room or there when Gideon was being abused and somewhat threatened that this would happen to him if he told.  It would be good if we got to the source of his jeleousy.

 

Sheens

[LN Cronan]

On the subject of Eva still working out her anger against Gideon for his having used Corrine -- and his celebrityhood -- to hurt Eva.

 

Bottom of page 225, her telling about the dinner reservation she made for her and Brett at Tableau One, the restaurant Gideon co-owns with his longtime personal friend, celebrity chef Arnoldo Ricci.

 

" ... I had to use your name to get on the (reservation) list, but Brett asked me out to dinner and I wanted us to go to a place connected with you."

 

When Gideon started going out with Corrine again, the first place he took her was on a dinner date to Tableau One, where he'd taken Eva just four nights earlier. He could have gotten a good table at any restaurant in New York, but he picked that one.

Eva is getting even by picking Tableau One, instead of any other good restaurant. Dropping Brett's name, she could have gotten a reservation at many other good places.

A paparazzi got pictures of Gideon having dinner with Corrine at Tableau One, thereby starting the media feeding frenzy about Gideon reuniting with Corrine. When Eva got even by taking Brett to lunch the next day, she harbored an angry impulsive hope a paparazzi would shoot a picture of her out with Brett, so Eva deliberately chose lunch at a restaurant where some paparazzi had photographed her and Cary having lunch, that started the rumors she and Cary were sexually involved.

Eva subconsciously hoping a paparazzi will get pictures of her and Brett out to dinner, and start a feeding frenzy of rumors they're dating? Getting even with Gideon for having indirectly humiliated Eva as having meant little to him, so now Eva is making it look like mere weeks later, she's already gotten over Gideon?

The second time Gideon took Corrine out, it involved something that "connected" Gideon and Eva -- the Kingsman vodka advertising campaign. Gideon took Corrine to a work-related PR event for Kingsman, an event by it's very nature was designed to get media attention, including photographers.

Eva is getting even by letting Brett take her to a Vidal Records corporate event, a PR event by it's very nature is designed to get media attention, including photographers. Guaranteed she and Brett will come under joint attention, because she's the girl in "Golden."

Gideon arranged the Kingsman the event behind the backs of Eva's agency, which was working only on the advertising campaign. He had his PR people set up the event, and never bothered to tell anyone from Eva's agency about it, despite the fact he had a meeting with Eva's agency mere hours before the event.

Eva getting even by making sure Gideon was going to find out second hand about her and Brett going to Tableau One, because she used Gideon's name to get the reservation. When was she planning to tell Gideon where she was having dinner? He's the one who brought the subject up, not the other way around.

Eva made it clear to Gideon that Brett asked her out to dinner, not the other way around.

Revenge for Gideon having asked his ex out.

 

From pages 13-14 of Entwined, Gideon and Eva were making love again for the first time, and she scratched and then bit him. "To punish as well as pleasure. To make him experience some small measure of what I had when he'd pushed me away." 

From page 176 of Reflected, what Eva said when she figured out her motive for having kissed Brett in a place where Gideon was certain to come across them. "Because you deserved it! Because you should know what it feels like! How bad it hurts ..."

So now she's set things up to let Gideon know exactly how it feels to have to endure media coverage of her and Brett, rumors running wild that they're reunited -- and Gideon is history, little more than a summer fling. She's now back with Brett, who publicly wooed her (via the love song and at least one media interview.) Because Corrine "got him back" by publicly chasing him at a high-society event, and when Gideon set up the lie he was back with Corrine, Eva came across as just a summer fling, not someone he'd loved.

[Sheens263]

Interview with Sylvia on FB, worth a listen

 

http://snd.sc/12WMgep

[Fayeth]

Hi Fayeth, 

It was my understanding as well that Gideon was arranging, or in the process of trying to make a deal with Deanna, about her getting the exclusive rights to Gideon and Eva's upcoming wedding nuptials.  Thus far no one knows that Gideon and Eva are married and I think that they intend on keeping it that way. 

 

 

Thank you for confirming my initial thoughts about the wedding pictures.  I wonder if pictures even exist from the secret wedding, if they do I am assuming they were taken by either Angus or the resort manager.

[sscrph]

Hi Peachies  & Everyone, 

I just wanted to clarify that what I meant by stating the "Vidal's" was; Elizabeth Vidal, Christopher Sr. Vidal and Ireland Vidal.  I know that you ladies know the books so much better than I do, because you have all read the books so many times (and listened on audio, etc.), could you please let me know on which pages exactly and which books exactly it states that Elizabeth, Ireland and Christopher Sr. Vidal attended the same charity events that Gideon and Eva did.  Thanks in advance.

As far as I know Elizabeth and Ireland have not attended a charity event , only CV Jr attended the first one- the Advocacy Dinner where he asked Eva to dance to find out who she was and what she was to Gideon. The only charity event Elizabeth attended was the last one in EWY at Cipriani's where she saw Eva's ring... Ireland has attended none to my knowledge.

[jennpenn926]

Hi Jennpenn926,

I don't know what the statistics are on abuse victims becoming pedophiles themselves. I wouldn't even want to hazard a guess. Given the circumsances that happened with my school; I don't think that any of the kids who were abused ever thought that what happened was normal. Many of those who were abused, suffered greatly. Many had horrendous addictions to drugs and/or alcohol and weren't able to complete their schooling or maintain employment. To the best of knowledge, not one victim in my graduating class went on to abuse anyone else. Thank you God for that.

The interesting part of this whole situation is the fact that none of the parents or staff thought it fit to call the police or Children's Aid/CPS. Everyone involved literally turned a blind eye to what was going on. Many people were reluctant to come forward and speak about what happened to them because they were afraid of the stigma attached to being an abuse survivor. Some people felt that it was best to leave well-enough alone or that it wasn't any of their business. So it was this silence that allowed one sick individual to wreak havoc on countless lives.

When I was in school I took Criminal Justice classes all 4 years and 63% of pedophiles have said they were abused as children themselves. You're right they don't think its normal by traditional standards but its their normal. Most pedophiles know they are sick and disgusting people. Every once in awhile you get a really sick s.o.b that tries to justifiy their actions saying the child wanted and or loved it. Either way they all need to be shot. And anyone who doesn't call the police or CPS is just as guilty.

[jennpenn926]

Hi Jennpenn926,

I don't know what the statistics are on abuse victims becoming pedophiles themselves. I wouldn't even want to hazard a guess. Given the circumsances that happened with my school; I don't think that any of the kids who were abused ever thought that what happened was normal. Many of those who were abused, suffered greatly. Many had horrendous addictions to drugs and/or alcohol and weren't able to complete their schooling or maintain employment. To the best of knowledge, not one victim in my graduating class went on to abuse anyone else. Thank you God for that.

The interesting part of this whole situation is the fact that none of the parents or staff thought it fit to call the police or Children's Aid/CPS. Everyone involved literally turned a blind eye to what was going on. Many people were reluctant to come forward and speak about what happened to them because they were afraid of the stigma attached to being an abuse survivor. Some people felt that it was best to leave well-enough alone or that it wasn't any of their business. So it was this silence that allowed one sick individual to wreak havoc on countless lives.

When I was in school I took Criminal Justice classes all 4 years and 63% of pedophiles have said they were abused as children themselves. You're right they don't think its normal by traditional standards but its their normal. Most pedophiles know they are sick and disgusting people. Every once in awhile you get a really sick s.o.b that tries to justifiy their actions saying the child wanted and or loved it. Either way they all need to be shot. And anyone who doesn't call the police or CPS is just as guilty.

[jennpenn926]

Sorry about the double postings.

[LN Cronan]

Thank you for confirming my initial thoughts about the wedding pictures.  I wonder if pictures even exist from the secret wedding, if they do I am assuming they were taken by either Angus or the resort manager.

 

Gideon arranged every detail, right down to making sure the closet full of clothes he got for Eva for the weekend including a wedding dress. He had to have included a photographer -- how could he not want pictures?

[Sheens263]

Gideon arranged every detail, right down to making sure the closet full of clothes he got for Eva for the weekend including a wedding dress. He had to have included a photographer -- how could he not want pictures?

I would not have said the dress was a wedding dress, she did say it was the prettiest dress in the closet so I just took it as a lovely sun dress, nothing too fancy but floaty for the warm sun, I could be wrong though

[Barb55]

I would not have said the dress was a wedding dress, she did say it was the prettiest dress in the closet so I just took it as a lovely sun dress, nothing too fancy but floaty for the warm sun, I could be wrong though

 

Did she describe it as the priestess gown??

[Sheens263]

Did she describe it as the priestess gown??

I must listen again to that, I am up to the concert on Audio for the 4th time so will listen to the wedding again as I am sure she said dress but I could be wrong 

[Sharonm745]

Hi Sharon745, 

Thank you for your comments.  I agree that there were a lot of false beliefs.  What gets me is the fact, that these were repeatedly abused by this "teacher" and the families were complaining left, right and centre (to the Board of Education and to the Principal), but no one thought to go to the police. What's worse is that NO ONE said a word to anyone else to warn them about what was going on!!!  Which means that this person had unfettered access to fresh potential victims every year!!

 

I don't know about you, but I don't think that I would be feeling too charitable towards any parent who didn't go to the police or call CPS or at least warn me before I sent my son or daughter to that school.  The "teacher" was finally removed after 30 plus years and now does administrative work for the Board of Education, but his removal from the class room doesn't undo all of the harm that he did to all of those victims.   Thank you for the discussion.

 

GiGi

 

I agree.  I don't know why some people keep quiet when they could prevent abuse of another child.  I have to believe they think they are doing what is best for their child (usually protecting them from publicity) but they just don't have the forethought to think clearly about what silence means.  I don't think that any punishment is too harsh for a child abuser and, quite frankly, I think their punishment needs to cause them great pain and suffering. 

[Sheens263]

Afternoon delight