One Chapter A Day - Re-Read Of Bared and Entwined

[julie54]

 What I find interesting is that on one hand Sylvia describe's Elizabeth and Ireland as obsidian haired (from Eva's perspective) yet in the next breath Ireland is described as a brunette.  Does our beloved Eva have cataracts? Did Sylvia do this for controversy or was there a specific reason?  What do you think?  What does everyone think? 

Hearing and sight problems! Gideon may want to change his mind and opt for a new model! Lol

[GiGi]

I was going to bed, but I'm having to much fun.

Eva Monica etc seemed to think that Gideon had a brunette fetish. Although he did admit, that if he did it was unconsciously. Eva suspected it had to do with Corrine. Magdalene wanted to look like Corrine, hoping to get his engine running, but it didn't work. I think it has to do with his mum. Corrine is described as a mummy lookalike. Beautiful slim with long black hair. I just think Gideon was looking for his mums love in these women who were brunettes. By discarding them after sex, he is in effect punishing his mum. I'm probably way off base here.

Hi Julie54,

You make some very interesting points.  After reading that I have to wonder whether Gideon wasn't just punishing himself in the end.  Wouldn't he have been denying himself the potential of love?  Surely at least some of these women may have had interest in pursuing a relationship with Gideon.

 

Does Gideon believe that he isn't worth loving?  Wouldn't his actions somehow be saying that?  Sorry just one other quick question:  If Gideon had been screwed over by his mother in his early childhood, could Gideon have been sleeping with all these women to "literally" screw his mother over?  Do you get what I mean?  Am I making sense? Thoughts? 

[julie54]

Do you think that Gideon's main issue is Elizabeth's lack of belief in her son (as if that isn't enough of a reason to cause issues) or do think that there is something more going on there?  What do you think?

well there was that weird comment from Gideon at the garden party, that I posted early. Gideon said to his mum when she met Cary " I thought you would like him". It just sounded sinister

[GiGi]

Hearing and sight problems! Gideon may want to change his mind and opt for a new model! Lol

That's ok!  I am sure that Gideon has more than enough money to get Eva all the medical help she may need.

[julie54]

Hi Julie54,

You make some very interesting points.  After reading that I have to wonder whether Gideon wasn't just punishing himself in the end.  Wouldn't he have been denying himself the potential of love?  Surely at least some of these women may have had interest in pursuing a relationship with Gideon.

 

Does Gideon believe that he isn't worth loving?  Wouldn't his actions somehow be saying that?  Sorry just one other quick question:  If Gideon had been screwed over by his mother in his early childhood, could Gideon have been sleeping with all these women to "literally" screw his mother over?  Do you get what I mean?  Am I making sense? Thoughts? 

You have got where I'm coming from. Which if is the case, is very disturbing. I said the other day I thought she might have a penchant for young men.

[Ript]

Hi Ript,

I was wondering that too.  Monica had been married three times.  Barker was her first husband (where they lived, who knows?) but there was a second marriage before Stanton, so what I wonder is if Monica moved Eva around during her early years (while she was busy getting married and divorced).  I wonder what Monica considered "home base".  If one of her marriages didn't work out, where would Monica go to regroup?  Would she stay in the state that she had been living in while she was married or would she pick up and move back to her home state?  What do you think?  What does everyone think?

Hi Gigi: it is very confusing. Hopefully Monica's previous husbands all lived in the same area. If not, the moving around probably also contributed to Eva's insecurities. She would have had a very unstable upbringing.

[Peachies]

Ciao Gabri,

I was thinking about what you said about Eva and her fashion choices and something struck me. Eva is a very sexual person internally and externally. Most women wouldn't wear garters with stockings. The garters can be uncomfortable and the lines may show through the clothing (depending on what they would wear).

I think that if we polled the women of this forum, I think that many would say that if they had to wear stockings, they would most likely choose the convenience of pantyhose. The reference of garters and stockings are usually reserved for sexy or romantic evenings. Perhaps this is a North American thing, perhaps not. What do you think? What does everyone think?

Personally I wear stockings when I wear a dress or skirt. Most if the time its the kind that stay up on their own as I don't want the lines of a garter holding them up. But depending on the dress or skirt I may opt for a garter too.

[GiGi]

You have got where I'm coming from. Which if is the case, is very disturbing. I said the other day I thought she might have a penchant for young men.

I think that as much as Elizabeth Vidal is despised, I hope that Sylvia addresses this issue.  I really want to know why Gideon is as screwed up as he is.  What on earth did Elizabeth Vidal do or not do to make him turn out this way?

[julie54]

Hi Julie54,

You make some very interesting points.  After reading that I have to wonder whether Gideon wasn't just punishing himself in the end.  Wouldn't he have been denying himself the potential of love?  Surely at least some of these women may have had interest in pursuing a relationship with Gideon.

 

Does Gideon believe that he isn't worth loving?  Wouldn't his actions somehow be saying that?  Sorry just one other quick question:  If Gideon had been screwed over by his mother in his early childhood, could Gideon have been sleeping with all these women to "literally" screw his mother over?  Do you get what I mean?  Am I making sense? Thoughts? 

Just thought, perhaps as a child, Gideon felt unworthy of love. His dad was taken away from him, his mother remarried got pregnant quickly, he probably felt abandoned by her too. Who else was going to love him? Poor child.

[julie54]

I'm sure EWY is going to be nothing like we're are discussing. Way off tangent!

[GiGi]

Personally I wear stockings when I wear a dress or skirt. Most if the time its the kind that stay up on their own as I don't want the lines of a garter holding them up. But depending on the dress or skirt I may opt for a garter too.

 

Hi Peachies,

I was thinking about Sylvia's description of the type of stockings that Eva wore.  She said that they were silk.  If that was the case, they wouldn't have a self adhesive strip at the top of the stocking and as such would require a garter to keep them up.  You also mentioned that you don't like to wear garters because of the visible lines that are present when wearing them.  Did Gideon perhaps see those VPL's (visible panty lines or should I say garter lines)?  Could that have attracted him to Eva initially? 

 

You have to admit that there is something really sexy about a woman who would wear garters.  What do you think?  What does everyone think?

[GiGi]

Just thought, perhaps as a child, Gideon felt unworthy of love. His dad was taken away from him, his mother remarried got pregnant quickly, he probably felt abandoned by her too. Who else was going to love him? Poor child.

I think that Gideon may have also felt like he was being replaced.  Elizabeth Vidal got pregnant very quickly after she got married.  She also had a boy which probably must have very upsetting for Gideon.  Now Gideon wouldn't have a place in his step-father's heart.  He now had a son of his own and Gideon was no one's son.  What's worse, Gideon's father was hated and Gideon was being punihed for his father's sins.   

[Kirsten]

Hi Sscrph,

That's an incredibly astute observation.  Think about the dress that Monica sent Eva for the advocacy dinner...holy cow!  How many mothers would send their daughters dresses like that? 

How about when she "borrowed" Eva's dress in RIY when they were going to dinner and dancing after being pampered all day when Monica brought the spa to their apartment. Yes I think you are right Sscrph and Gigi Eva gets her fashion sense from her mother. I also have to agree with the stockings vs pantyhose statement you made Gigi.

[julie54]

Hi Peachies,

I was thinking about Sylvia's description of the type of stockings that Eva wore.  She said that they were silk.  If that was the case, they wouldn't have a self adhesive strip at the top of the stocking and as such would require a garter to keep them up.  You also mentioned that you don't like to wear garters because of the visible lines that are present when wearing them.  Did Gideon perhaps see those VPL's (visible panty lines or should I say garter lines)?  Could that have attracted him to Eva initially? 

 

You have to admit that there is something really sexy about a woman who would wear garters.  What do you think?  What does everyone think?

Stockings and stilettos are most men's dream. If they had to wear them, they might have second thoughts.

[GiGi]

Hi Gigi: it is very confusing. Hopefully Monica's previous husbands all lived in the same area. If not, the moving around probably also contributed to Eva's insecurities. She would have had a very unstable upbringing.

Hi Ript,

I think that Monica was so busy trying to keep a husband and a roof over her and Eva's head that she forgot the basics of how to be a good mother.  I somehow saw Monica and Eva moving around.  If Victor is in California then where did Monica meet Victor and what made either of them decide to move?  In Monica's case I could see her moving to be with her husband or for his work, but what's the deal with Victor?   

[Kirsten]

Hi ShazScott1980,

You make some great points!!  I never thought that Gideon might have other reasons to hate his father!!  I also agree that I don't necessarily buy the arguement that Gideon has mommy issues.  There isn't enough for the reader to go, but I will wait until June 4th to vote on that topic.  Like it or not, I hope that we the readers get more information about why Gideon hates his mother so much.  Was it the fact that Elizabeth Vidal didn't believe her son when he told her about the abuse (which would be MORE than enough reason to hate someone), or did his mother do something else, maybe even more despicable than that? 

 

I agree with you in that Gideon may have had serious issues about his mother marrying someone else so soon after his father's death.  Even under the best circumstanes, children may not be thrilled with a parent decides to remarry.  GIven the circumstances that lead to Gideon's father's death, I think that Elizabeth's remarriage to Christopher Sr. may have just been the straw that broke the camel's back.  What do you think?  What does everyone think?

Is it possible that Elizabeth started having an affair with Vidal Sr. while Gideon's dad was still alive, and that is what finally sent him over the edge? It would explain why Gideon hates Vidal.

[julie54]

I think that Gideon may have also felt like he was being replaced. Elizabeth Vidal got pregnant very quickly after she got married. She also had a boy which probably must have very upsetting for Gideon. Now Gideon wouldn't have a place in his step-father's heart. He now had a son of his own and Gideon was no one's son. What's worse, Gideon's father was hated and Gideon was being punihed for his father's sins.

I agree. Children are very impressionable at that age. His dad dying, his mother effectively abandoning him, his new dad not legally adopting him. Why didn't Elizabeth convince Chris Vidal Snr to adopt Gideon? To make him feel part of the family. Gideon is the black sheep of the family. Seemingly hated by them all except Ireland.

[GiGi]

Stockings and stilettos are most men's dream. If they had to wear them, they might have second thoughts.

 

 Now I am sitting here roaring with laughter!!!

[GiGi]

How about when she "borrowed" Eva's dress in RIY when they were going to dinner and dancing after being pampered all day when Monica brought the spa to their apartment. Yes I think you are right Sscrph and Gigi Eva gets her fashion sense from her mother. I also have to agree with the stockings vs pantyhose statement you made Gigi.

Hi Kirsten,

What Sylvia describes is more of a friendship type of relationship than a mother-daughter relationship.  It is incredibly odd, because the only other time that I get a sense of any kind of mothering is Eva's mothering of her mother.  She is the one who takes her mother's feelings into consideration, she is the one who alters her actions and reactions to spare her mother's feelings.  It is almost as if Eva walks on egg shells where her mother is concerned. 

 

The only way that Eva seems to defy her mother  is in the way that she deals with her relationship with Gideon and also through her fashion.  She shows up in sweats and tells Gideon off, acts like herself (doesn't hide herself) just to appear like the "perfect" or "ideal" girlfriend.  What do you think?  What does everyone think?

[sscrph]

Hi Ript,

I think that Monica was so busy trying to keep a husband and a roof over her and Eva's head that she forgot the basics of how to be a good mother.  I somehow saw Monica and Eva moving around.  If Victor is in California then where did Monica meet Victor and what made either of them decide to move?  In Monica's case I could see her moving to be with her husband or for his work, but what's the deal with Victor?   

No I kind of assumed Victor and Monica were both from California and she moved once she married Barker. I think Victor has always lived in San Diego. We never know where husbands Barker and Mitchell were based but Eva went to live with Victor when Monica's marriage to Mitchell was deteriorating. I think she went to more than 4 years of college because she mentions doing a thesis when Gideon has her on her couch before the advocacy dinner so I believe she may have obtained a masters degree what does everyone think? So I put her about age 24 also.

[sscrph]

Hi Kirsten,

What Sylvia describes is more of a friendship type of relationship than a mother-daughter relationship.  It is incredibly odd, because the only other time that I get a sense of any kind of mothering is Eva's mothering of her mother.  She is the one who takes her mother's feelings into consideration, she is the one who alters her actions and reactions to spare her mother's feelings.  It is almost as if Eva walks on egg shells where her mother is concerned. 

 

The only way that Eva seems to defy her mother  is in the way that she deals with her relationship with Gideon and also through her fashion.  She shows up in sweats and tells Gideon off, acts like herself (doesn't hide herself) just to appear like the "perfect" or "ideal" girlfriend.  What do you think?  What does everyone think?

Totally agree with this Gigi and I think that Monica feels like she failed in the mother role so she is trying for an A as a girlfriend...

[GiGi]

I agree. Children are very impressionable at that age. His dad dying, his mother effectively abandoning him, his new dad not legally adopting him. Why didn't Elizabeth convince Chris Vidal Snr to adopt Gideon? To make him feel part of the family. Gideon is the black sheep of the family. Seemingly hated by them all except Ireland.

It is so strange because somehow I don't think that Vidal Sr. adopting Gideon would have solved anything.  I think that Vidal Sr. didn't want Gideon to start with and I also think that no matter what Gideon may or may not have done wouldn't have helped the situation.   

 

I really believe in my heart of hearts, that it takes a very special person to raise another man's son.  I just don't think that Vidal Sr. was that type of man.  If we look at Gideon's behaviour, it sounds like a kid who had given up all hope.  What's the point of being a good kid when no one wants you and everyone hated your real dad? 

 

I think that the problems with Vidal Sr. and Gideon began at the very beginning.  Maybe he laid down and law with Gideon and Gideon balked.  He was a five year old child after all and I would think that given all of the emotional upheaval that Gideon had suffered, he may have had a temper tantrum or two, because he verbally and emotionally didn't have the skill set to express how he felt.  That type of scenario could have spelt a recipe for disaster (which in hindsight may have).  What do you think? What does everyone think?

[julie54]

Hi Kirsten,

What Sylvia describes is more of a friendship type of relationship than a mother-daughter relationship.  It is incredibly odd, because the only other time that I get a sense of any kind of mothering is Eva's mothering of her mother.  She is the one who takes her mother's feelings into consideration, she is the one who alters her actions and reactions to spare her mother's feelings.  It is almost as if Eva walks on egg shells where her mother is concerned. 

 

The only way that Eva seems to defy her mother  is in the way that she deals with her relationship with Gideon and also through her fashion.  She shows up in sweats and tells Gideon off, acts like herself (doesn't hide herself) just to appear like the "perfect" or "ideal" girlfriend.  What do you think?  What does everyone think?

Eva just wants to be normal. Big money doesn't bother her. She chose to take a job which meant starting at the bottom and working her way up. She wants a relationship for love, not a credit account at Bloomingdales.

On that note goodnight. It's 1am in the UK .

[GiGi]

Is it possible that Elizabeth started having an affair with Vidal Sr. while Gideon's dad was still alive, and that is what finally sent him over the edge? It would explain why Gideon hates Vidal.

You never know.  Just when we the readers think we have everything figured out Sylvia throws us all a curve ball.  At this point nothing would surprise me.  You could tell me that Angus was Gideon's real father and that he had an affair with Elizabeth Vidal and somehow I probably would buy it.  Sigh!  How many more days until June 4th? 

[GiGi]

Eva just wants to be normal. Big money doesn't bother her. She chose to take a job which meant starting at the bottom and working her way up. She wants a relationship for love, not a credit account at Bloomingdales.

On that note goodnight. It's 1am in the UK .

Sleep well.  We wil catch up tomorrow.